Hello !
I want ask there any modules / bridge to allow easy connect PhpBB3 Forum with Zikula project ?
I know there is project Zafenio. But look pretty dead. And i don't think so they run PhpBB3 on zikula. I go download page http://code.zikula.org/zafenio/downloads there are only pnPHPBB2 ( base on PhpBB2 ?? ) i'm confused about what they doing with this project forum looks dead.
So i'm ask you friends. There are any way to bring famous forum to zikula ? Most important is to keep forum away from bugs and don't make a lot modification Zikula each time update forum.
Thank you for your Time/Answer.
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zkManiac
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Posted: Mar 18, 2010 - 10:21 PM
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Posted: Mar 18, 2010 - 10:57 PM
Many people here will tell you pnForum is fine.
However, my point of view is that:
- it is feature-poor (this is the correct wording for the "streamlined" bullshit buzzword)
- there are still many bugs
- the developer community of pnForum is not very active, so you'll see no cool hacks or plugins for pnForum. The reason is they don't do money with that module, and don't have a user community to feed with new cool stuff.
I have, therefore I use PNphpbb2.
edited by: manarak, datetimebrief -
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Posted: Mar 18, 2010 - 11:09 PM
Manarak: Thank you for you answer.
I don't have option to you something else that PhpBB3. We have PNphpBB2 forum with 60,000+ posts, 10,000+ accounts. We don't want change into Dizkus / pnForum because many our user will lost using new system. PhpBB know a lot people and know how to use it. And we want easy migrate PM / Forum Data to PhpBB3. And keep everything update and clean.
So we searching solution how to easy ( without bugs ) connect Zikula with PhpBB3 system.
If someone can send advice how to do this or redirect to project i will be grateful.
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Posted: Mar 18, 2010 - 11:40 PM
Your best bet is to ask a developer to do it for you.
It will cost $$$ but at least it will get done.
You could then sell the module to Zikula users. -
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Posted: Mar 19, 2010 - 12:09 AM
Manarak: Thank you for you answer.
You want say nobody is taking care to connect PhpBB version 3 to Zikula ?
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Posted: Mar 19, 2010 - 03:08 AM
The Zafenio project is working on Zafenio, which is exactly what you are looking for. While our forums are not "dead", but just low traffic, I have to say honestly that we are just 2 developers working on it ATM. Most of the team is busy with other work, and has no time to contribute. So, we cannot promise anything (specially release dates) by now. ATM we have a very early alpha version without installer, which still has a bulk load of bugs to fix before we can give it out for testing.
Meanwhile, we do still support PNphpBB2, add security patches from upstream, and continue with fixing the last known bugs there. We also keep it working for Zikula (e.g. our own forum at http://zafenio.com runs at Zikula 1.2.2, as do several other sites). When Zafenio will be ready, there will be of course a proper upgrade path, and also a working conversion script from phpBB3 to Zikula + Zafenio. This means you have 2 options if you need a full featured and well known forum in Zikula: Use PNphpBB2 until Zafenio is done, or use phpBB3 standalone until then.
If you do not need all the features phpBB3 comes with, and specially when starting a new forum community, I would recommend to use pnForum/Dizkus. It's a fine and well performing forum module, perfectly integrated in Zikula, and development is active.
Greetings,
Chris
edited by: slam, datetimebrief
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Posted: Mar 19, 2010 - 05:39 AM
Quote
- it is feature-poor (this is the correct wording for the "streamlined" bullshit buzzword)
What you call a "Bullshit buzzword" is exactly why I use it. I don't want the forum module handling all the extras, the only think I like about phpBB that lacks in Zikula hooks is hooking a poll to the module, and in theory it's possible, I just don't understand how hooks work to the point where I can modify one of the poll modules for it.
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Posted: Mar 19, 2010 - 09:38 PM
Well, phpBB (and therefore PNphpBB2/Zafenio) includes many features you will not find in Dizkus. Some of them might be used via Zikula Hooks and other modules, but I have not seen a full featured working installation of Dizkus going that far. Most important features (all of them tested and optimized over years):
1) Fine grained and easy to manage forum permission system
2) Use of phpBB themes and plugins (there are thousands of them)
3) integrated feature rich upload/attachment module
4) dedicated forum user profile and Avatar management and many options
5) Integrated private message system
6) Detailed integrated User and Admin manuals
7) Group mailer
8) Word censor and batch text replace
9) Extended search features with own cache and index
10) Own user and group management
11) Full size forum view
So, with PNphpBB2 you can do out of the box much more than you probably ever could do with Dizkus + other modules (after configuring all that together). And with PNphpBB2 everything looks and works as your users and moderators know it from phpBB - most will not even recognize that the forum is integrated into Zikula.
Please do not misunderstand this post: I very much appreciate the fine work done with Dizkus, and I use and recommend it myself where appropriate. It's just that you cannot really compare the 2 forum modules - each of them targets an entirely different use case.
Greetings,
Chris
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Posted: Mar 20, 2010 - 02:09 AM
I think Slam summarized it well.
BTW, Slam, thanks for your excellent work on PNphpbb2.
PHPBB3 is now probably the only missing module that keeps me from moving to Zikula on some of my sites.
The rest I can supplement by programmng/tweaking myself and bypassing the rendering engine with direct PHP output.
Polls have been mentioned by HalbrookTech, but I could also throw in file attachments, picture attachments, the email notifications work, etc.
and PHPBB3 would add tons of new stuff like youtube embedding, etc.
If I need a "streamlined" forum, well, I just switch off the unneeded features.
Much easier than to program tons of new ones, just because they aren't needed in the IT-developer community.
The main point here though is the lack of momentum due to the lack of webmasters using the modules.
I have some large communities (one with over 50.000 users), and feel the pressure of competing sites.
Users ask why it is not possible to do X or Y like on some other sites.
Websites are pure marketing:
They need to be new, cool, up to date and full of features and gadgets.
Don't forget that websites cater to the "other" part of IQ percentiles.
So... I don't have the time to develop all features and I need a product that is feature-loaded.
I do have the time to "tweak" things, when the base product is programmed in an understandable and linear way.
But the newer products get more difficult to understand, and the object-oriented stuff with abstraction layers and pipes into rendering engines take too much time to modify.
With every additional layer of complexity, the number of webmasters able to modify the modules decreases.
Zikula or every other CMS/framework system will never be able to cover 100% of the needs of websites.
On the other hand, if webmasters have to spend money on programmers to modify systems like Zikula, Drupal or Joomla to do what the webmasters want, where is the benefit of using such a system?
But I have been saying the same things over and over for years... one more time won't make any difference, so I stop here.
edited by: manarak, datetimebrief -
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Posted: Mar 20, 2010 - 06:47 AM
While I agree with manarak somehow, I also very much appreciate the modern design and programming policies Zikula is following. It leads into better performing professional web sites. Yes, it might add one or another step to learn and adapt for hobbyists. But I feel that the times of hobby web designers are over, anyway. Those who do not want to learn and adapt their sites are moving over to managed hosted applications, and are using the provided features as they are. Future Zikula distributions might re-take this market, Zikula itself has matured into a sophisticated web application framework, though.
Actually, I like where the net goes. Technical stuff goes back to those who know about it, and content goes back to those who know how to create and provide good content. PNphpBB2 is a relict from older days when looking at it from this perspective, and we will see how Zafenio will do when it's done.
Greetings,
Chris
edited by: slam, datetimebrief
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Posted: Mar 20, 2010 - 08:48 AM
Quote
So... I don't have the time to develop all features and I need a product that is feature-loaded.
Then use Zafinio/PNphpBB2 that's why it exists, some people DO want it, but don't disparage Dizkus for being a lighter weight option.
Quote
1) Fine grained and easy to manage forum permission system
I've worked with phpBB, that's one of the areas I never liked/needed the complexity of on those sites.
Quote
2) Use of phpBB themes and plugins (there are thousands of them)
If it doesn't match the rest of my site I don't care about it personally, nor do my clients. I can customize Dizkus while customizing the theme, and use the same technolgies, did phpBB3 move to Smarty, I can't remember.
Quote
3) integrated feature rich upload/attachment module
I'm using MediaAttach quite succesfully for that, and it's available to the rest of the system, instead of being stuck as a feature only in my fourms, and it's the same across the board, not one method in the forums and a different one in the news and another one in portfolios.
Quote
4) dedicated forum user profile and Avatar management and many options
Again, achive this with myProfile or Profile and it's the same across the board, and with myProfile plenty of options for my users.
And again, I have Intercom there across the board.Quote
5) Integrated private message system
Quote
6) Detailed integrated User and Admin manuals
Things are in teh works system wide for that, at least I hope they are since I abandoned my fork of Tour to be that.
Quote
7) Group mailer
Got it in one of the modules, forget if it's core or addon tho.
Quote
8) Word censor and batch text replace
MultiHook, works for the whole system, not just the forums, one place to manage the information, not two.
Quote
10) Own user and group management
Again, why two places instead of one?
Quote
11) Full size forum view
Custom template for Dizkus and that's achieved. http://healthyeatingcentral.com forums are full view.
Not arguing, as we established above, there's a reason for both existing and having users. I've just outlined why I don't think those are selling points. They're either unneeded bloat to my file system or duplicated functions for my sites. Just to show Manarak there IS a good reason for it. As I said, teh only thing I've found in phpBB that I miss are the polls attached to the forum.
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Posted: Mar 20, 2010 - 08:45 PM
While I really understand that several of those points are no selling points for many webmasters running a forum, for several of them they are vital or important.HalbrookTech
... I've just outlined why I don't think those are selling points. They're either unneeded bloat to my file system or duplicated functions for my sites. Just to show Manarak there IS a good reason for it. As I said, teh only thing I've found in phpBB that I miss are the polls attached to the forum.
Just look at permissions: You might not need/like the PNphpBB2 permission system, but several bigger communities I know would be impossible to manage without them. And please do not tell me you can do the same with Zikula core permissions and Dizkus - you cannot even do 50% of it, and I will not even talk about the difference in useability for the admin.
Yes, you can do today parts of the functionalities I listed with different Zikula modules, and some adaptions - however, with installing PNphpBB2 it's done all and ready. And all those features are tested, bugfixed, improved and performance optimized over years in PNphpBB2, while many of the Zikula modules you mention are quite young. Again, I love, recommend and use all of them, but specially with bigger communities (and even more when they are used to phpBB) and demanding users PNphpBB2 is the only solution.
By The way, the Polls module in the forums is the only major feature I have never used and never liked.
Greetings,
Chris
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Posted: Mar 20, 2010 - 09:58 PM
I was a long time user of PNphpbb2, with about 80,000 messages, and a very active site.
Unfortunately when I moved from postnuke to Zikula there were many insurmountable problems and thus I had to drop the previous site and start fresh. As 0.764 was no longer supported, i knew I had to make the jump, even though I tried many times over the previous year (since the first RC's) to upgrade, following all the various tips, tricks, and suggestions. I'd been using postnuke since 2002, and nearly went to another CMS with more functionality, but couldn't quite bring myself to do it.
This change did not worry me, the community understood, and are returning the site, although they feel that the move to Zikula is seemingly a backward step. I can see their point. PN had a number of modules that have not progressed (spChat, paypal shopping cart ec) and a number of blocks. I have told them that full site functionality will be back soon, but the one thing they have really missed is pnphpbb2.
This could have been a show stopper - especially as there is no way to install it in Zikula as a fresh install. I had to fight hard, and work extensively to add the same functionality.... and even then it's not perfect with regards theming etc...
I'm hoping that when Zafenio finally comes out, there will be a conversion from Dizkus to Zafenio... but when there is little obvious movement in the development, I very much doubt there will be in the near future.
I used pnphpbb2 for around 5 years, and it was a sad day when I had to move on. if there was a way to install it fresh on Zikula I would have, but all seems lost in the name of progression. it's a shame, but Dizkus is the only viable option now.... and it has always seemed the "pour cousin" but it's currently the only one that works fresh.
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Posted: Mar 21, 2010 - 09:02 PM
While the installer still needs fixes to work on Zikula, you could have always installed/upgraded & activated PNphpBB2 manually. You could have also install and upgrade it on PN 0.764, and upgrade to Zikula from there. So, it's sad that you left it just because of that.
No, a Dizkus -> Zafenio conversion script is not planned. We do have a working phpBB2 -> PNphpBB2 script, we do have an almost ready phpBB3 -> Zafenio script, and of course we will include a proper upgrade script for PNphpBB2 -> Zafenio. Additionally, there are conversion scripts planned from other popular standalone forums to Zikula + Zafenio.
Greetings,
Chris
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Posted: Mar 29, 2010 - 01:59 AM
baph
I was a long time user of PNphpbb2, with about 80,000 messages, and a very active site.
Unfortunately when I moved from postnuke to Zikula there were many insurmountable problems and thus I had to drop the previous site and start fresh. As 0.764 was no longer supported, i knew I had to make the jump, even though I tried many times over the previous year (since the first RC's) to upgrade, following all the various tips, tricks, and suggestions. I'd been using postnuke since 2002, and nearly went to another CMS with more functionality, but couldn't quite bring myself to do it.
This change did not worry me, the community understood, and are returning the site, although they feel that the move to Zikula is seemingly a backward step. I can see their point. PN had a number of modules that have not progressed (spChat, paypal shopping cart ec) and a number of blocks. I have told them that full site functionality will be back soon, but the one thing they have really missed is pnphpbb2.
This could have been a show stopper - especially as there is no way to install it in Zikula as a fresh install. I had to fight hard, and work extensively to add the same functionality.... and even then it's not perfect with regards theming etc...
I'm hoping that when Zafenio finally comes out, there will be a conversion from Dizkus to Zafenio... but when there is little obvious movement in the development, I very much doubt there will be in the near future.
I used pnphpbb2 for around 5 years, and it was a sad day when I had to move on. if there was a way to install it fresh on Zikula I would have, but all seems lost in the name of progression. it's a shame, but Dizkus is the only viable option now.... and it has always seemed the "pour cousin" but it's currently the only one that works fresh.
Jon/Baph
I feel for you - I decided to stay with PN0.764 and PNphpBB2 until something viable comes out.
What did you replace SPChat with?
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