Zikula Community

• Yukulele
  
  

  • Rank: Freshman
  • Registered: Jul 18, 2002
  • Last visit: Dec 16, 2009
  • Posts: 88

  Posted: Dec 14, 2009 - 07:11 AM

  Hello folks,
  
  I searched the forum for an answer, to no available.
  In clear, i just want to get rid of all users which do not have a valid e-mail anymore, before upgrading a good old PN 0.764 to the latest Zikula.
  Last time i sent a newsletter to all users (via jdnMailer, an old module), i got more than 2000 "failure notice" because of unavailable mailbox, and the such. I warned all users in the forum (PNphpBB2) that past a precise date, all users with invalid e-mails will be deleted, and (unfortunately) the due date is coming fast :) .
  I just can't delete each user manually through the Admin, so i'm asking here if there's a way to automate this process ? Or maybe a dedicated module exist/did exist ?
  
  Thanks for any input to solve this issue.
  
  Bye.
  
  PS: just hoping there'll be a kind of auto-check in Zikula to avoid this kind of issues...

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 14, 2009 - 07:55 AM

  Removing users can cause a mulitude of problems. I wish there was an option to do exactly what you are requesting. However, I think your going to hear exactly what has been said in the past, and that it's not a good idea to remove users accounts.
  
  I'm sure someone could get into the nuts and bolts as to why, and it's basically that the users data floods over into other module data (IE: PNphpBB2).

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• Yukulele
  
  

  • Rank: Freshman
  • Registered: Jul 18, 2002
  • Last visit: Dec 16, 2009
  • Posts: 88

  Posted: Dec 14, 2009 - 08:48 AM

  Thanks for your answer, even if it's not a good news at all ...
  I started deleting like 100 users, and now i'm realizing all i'll get are zombie users in the pnphpbb_users table... Argh... I was pretty sure that deleting a user from the PN admin will remove it also in the PNphpBB2 base (and in the Comments, etc.), but that's not the case... Damned...
  
  What i see now is a clear lack of synchronisation between different modules... Sad...
  
  Does Zikula address this issue ?
  
  Bye.

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 14, 2009 - 12:42 PM

  No there is no real solution to the problem of PNphpBB2 and the user base of Zikula. This is the nature of the beast when using phpbb2 and this will follow with the next iteration of phpbb3, that might someday be available for Zikula. The nearest you can get to removing Zikula users and forum users is to switch to Dizkus.
  
  The problem with migrating your PNphpBB2 tables to Dizkus is that the script that is available does not do a clean conversion. You would need to spend hours manually converting parts of the conversion that the script did not address.
  
  Maybe it would be more appealing if I would take the script that is available and paid some fancy database programmer to make it complete. I don't really know if users would want pay to have their PNphpBB2 database converted and then returned to them ready to import to a new Dizkus install?

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• craigh
  
  

  • Rank: Developer
  • Registered: Jun 16, 2003
  • Last visit: May 29, 2010
  • Posts: 1966

  Posted: Dec 14, 2009 - 01:24 PM

  consider moving the users you would like to delete into a Zikula group (invalidusers) and then deleting them simply from the the Users group. this would essentially banish them if you gave that group no permissions, etc. Maybe your mailer can send only to a specific group?

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• slam
  
  

  • Rank: Team Member
  • Registered: May 03, 2004
  • Last visit: May 31, 2010
  • Posts: 511

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 01:13 AM

  Good practice is to simply make them inactive. There is no reason to actually delete the users, which will lead to many different problems - not just with PNphpBB2.
  Greetings,
  Chris
  
  --
  an operating system must operate
  development is life
  my repo

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 01:33 AM

  The users situation has always been a mess with Zikula and it's predecessors. The fact that PNphpBB2 is hooked into in such a fashion that removing users is just not the best idea. I'm thinking that PNphpBB2 is most likely the biggest of all that gets effected by the removal of users. The cleanest way to go, for forums is using Dizkus, if at all possible. A lot of users are forced to continue with PNphpBB2 because of the conversion issues.
  
  I use the Inactive feature, as I think it's the best method to disable users account at this time.

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• Paustian
  
  

  • Rank: Softmore
  • Registered: May 30, 2005
  • Last visit: May 31, 2010
  • Posts: 340

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 04:52 AM

  This is a pretty interesting situation. So it's normally a bad idea to delete users? What if you never used the PNphpBB2? What other modules store data that is dependent upon a user? Could this have performance issues eventually? I doubt it because mysql lookups are so fast. Is there a way to prevent this in the future?

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• Yukulele
  
  

  • Rank: Freshman
  • Registered: Jul 18, 2002
  • Last visit: Dec 16, 2009
  • Posts: 88

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 07:46 AM

  Thanks for all your inputs guys.
  
  Deactivation is not available in PN 0.764, as far as i can see... But let's say i go this way, do you know a simple way to automatically deactivate say like 1700 users via a text/csv file with all the e-mails ? And to do the same for PNphpBB2 ?
  
  I tried Dizkus, it's nice now, and i may consider it in the future if a valid import script is available at some point (near 100,000 messages, and 6/7000 real users, it must not go wrong :) ).
  I had big hopes for Zafenio (phpBB3), but i'm a bit tired of waiting (it's the main reason why i'm still with PN .764 ATM).
  
  Bye.

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• craigh
  
  

  • Rank: Developer
  • Registered: Jun 16, 2003
  • Last visit: May 29, 2010
  • Posts: 1966

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 08:49 AM

  I imported from pnphpbb2 to pnForum (dizkus) and didn't have any trouble at all. If you can, I would do the upgrade in a test environment and contact the authors if you have trouble. Dizkus is actively developed and I'm sure they would want to solve the problem.
  
  

  Quote

  do you know a simple way to automatically deactivate say like 1700 users via a text/csv file with all the e-mails ?

  
  probably easier to do a manual SQL call in phpMyAdmin or something: UPDATE table SET status=0 WHERE last_access

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 11:01 AM

  craigh

  I imported from pnphpbb2 to pnForum (dizkus) and didn't have any trouble at all. If you can, I would do the upgrade in a test environment and contact the authors if you have trouble. Dizkus is actively developed and I'm sure they would want to solve the problem.
  
  

  Quote

  do you know a simple way to automatically deactivate say like 1700 users via a text/csv file with all the e-mails ?

  
  probably easier to do a manual SQL call in phpMyAdmin or something: UPDATE table SET status=0 WHERE last_access

  
  
  You are refering to pnForum. There is currently no reliable way to import PNphpBB2 to Dizkus. Did you upgrade to pnForum and import using that?
  
  Maybe this is a way to get the conversion done; Install pnForum 2.7, migrate PNphpBB2 to pnForum, update to Dizkus 3.0? Will this work?
  
  I'm thinking that the problems will still be there. There are raw codes foe $ and more left after the conversion. Also it fails to convert the code, quote, and something else?

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 11:06 AM

  Yukulele

  Thanks for all your inputs guys.
  
  Deactivation is not available in PN 0.764, as far as i can see... But let's say i go this way, do you know a simple way to automatically deactivate say like 1700 users via a text/csv file with all the e-mails ? And to do the same for PNphpBB2 ?
  
  I tried Dizkus, it's nice now, and i may consider it in the future if a valid import script is available at some point (near 100,000 messages, and 6/7000 real users, it must not go wrong :) ).
  I had big hopes for Zafenio (phpBB3), but i'm a bit tired of waiting (it's the main reason why i'm still with PN .764 ATM).
  
  Bye.

  
  
  I'm with you. I've been forced to continue with PNphpBB2 becuse there is no way to migrate my data to anything else reliably. Would you be interested in having your PNphpBB2 database converted to Dizkus 3.x by a service and what do you think it might be worth. IE: You send your exported PNphpBB2 tables; they are converted to Dizkus; sent back to you; you install Dizkus as a new install; imprt the new tables, and your ready to go?

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• craigh
  
  

  • Rank: Developer
  • Registered: Jun 16, 2003
  • Last visit: May 29, 2010
  • Posts: 1966

  Posted: Dec 15, 2009 - 11:20 PM

  Quote

  You are refering to pnForum. There is currently no reliable way to import PNphpBB2 to Dizkus. Did you upgrade to pnForum and import using that?
  Maybe this is a way to get the conversion done; Install pnForum 2.7, migrate PNphpBB2 to pnForum, update to Dizkus 3.0? Will this work?

  
  That's what I did, yes. will it work? there is only one way to know that. test.

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• mesteele101
  
  

  • Rank: Helper
  • Registered: Sep 19, 2003
  • Last visit: May 25, 2010
  • Posts: 612

  Posted: Dec 16, 2009 - 12:54 AM

  Hummm; Maybe worth a shot.
  
  
  
  edited by: mesteele101, datetimebrief

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• Yukulele
  
  

  • Rank: Freshman
  • Registered: Jul 18, 2002
  • Last visit: Dec 16, 2009
  • Posts: 88

  Posted: Dec 16, 2009 - 06:05 AM

  I already tried importing in pnForum in the past (under PN .764, then upgrade to Dizkus with Zikula 1.0 at the time), it kind of works, but a lot of things from PNphpBB2 will just get lost in the process. Like:
  - attachments
  - quotes
  - smilies
  - moderators / special permissions
  - forum groups
  - auto links
  - etc.
  
  Apart quotes and attachments, it's not big of a deal, i could do with that, but honestly i would much prefer to stay with a phpBB model, which is widely used and well known by my users, and, yes, much more powerfull than pnForum/Dizkus. Forum is the central point of my community website, i can't go "backward"...
  
  Mesteele, yes i'm willing to donate $$$ if it could get the thing go forward... Preferably to the Zikula dev team, but still... Let me know.
  
  Anyway we're drifting a bit off-topic here .
  
  At first, Craigh said above a SQL query could do the job (deactivate "false" users), any idea how, knowing my user list is only based on e-mail ? A massive move to an "Inactive" group with no permission could do it also.
  Secondly, how to transmit these changes to the PNphpBB2 users table ?
  
  Thanks to all for your inputs, even if it's quite bad news all in all... I've been a long time PN user, tried lot of alternatives (Drupal and Joomla to name a few, now building Magento sites), but i would much prefer stay at home with Zikula (great philosophy, great support (IMHO)). Sad some simple real life situations like this are not adressed yet...
  
  Bye.
  
  PS: just wondering if Zikula has a registration check built in ? Like e-mail validation, or the such ?
  
  
  
  edited by: Yukulele, datetimebrief

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