Zikula Community

• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Expert
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Apr 02, 2010
  • Posts: 1208

  Posted: Jul 21, 2007 - 02:41 AM

  Hey Mark,
  
  You must've missed my post on the teams mailing list. :)
  
  

  Quote

  I have added the pnAdmin theme to the SVN under my project at:
  http://noc.postnuke.com/projects/dynawerx/
  
  You will see that the PSD file is included in the images directory. The master template is the same as pn.com, since that is the basis for the admin templates. The other files all pertain to the pn.com theme and need to be updated or whatever to transform them into this new pnAdmin theme. The PSD could also be sliced.
  
  Anyone that wishes to help can request to join and I'll happily add you.

  
  
  You've been added to the project.

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• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Registered User
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Feb 29, 2008
  • Posts: 12

  Posted: Jul 21, 2007 - 05:27 PM

  hi all! generally a big thx to everybody working his / her butt off to make 0.8 reality!!! i am not a programmer at all - actually you mainly lose me when you start trying to explain problems falling back at all kind of "weird code". i started my stuff with phpnuke and realized it aint the gral yet, i went to PN and met new limitations and problems - but generally i was happier and it seems to be the safer option.
  i d/l 0.8 and installed it in my "sandbox" to play with. so far i like a lot and since i just started i dont claim that i checked it all yet etc...
  anyway, some thoughts of a user (i like to tinker around, i am able to find answers to my problems online, i am not afraid to brake stuff while guessing and experimenting and re-uploading after messing it up):
  
  - a decent "manual" would be nice, i realize its a RC but you scare ppl away rather than win them over
  
  - i personally hoped for a permissions system thats easy to use (its still killing me with every new module to figure out which godda**ed group needs to be placed in what position to make it all work), it just makes it hard for many ppl to administer their sites and make sure ppl dont run all over areas they shouldnt be in. it cant be that hard to improve on it - or is it??? i sure dont know :)
  
  - as i said, just starting to trial and error my way to it - is there a simple solution in 0.8 to have a homepage loaded with diverse stuff without using v4b new content??? and its limitations. plz dont scream Pagesetter back at me :) (if and when i figured out PN, i will try to get my head around ps)
  
  all said, it looks nice, seems improved in many ways and now we all would love you more if you make it usable for everybody!
  
  mac

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• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Registered User
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Feb 29, 2008
  • Posts: 12

  Posted: Jul 21, 2007 - 05:46 PM

  and just as an afterthought, dont lose yourself in theme issues over the important stuff. a) i dont think the theme for the install matters at this point - its straight forward and you see it once (if all goes well) per website. no reason to get all carried away and artistic there. b) basic themes coming with the install are a matter of personal taste and you will never make everybody happy. most ppl will find a theme for there website anyway somewhere else and / or play around and change things to their needs. i dont think the existing ones are very impressive nor the ones in the .7x version, but it gets you started and there is a load out there free and commercial to fit your needs.......

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• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Senior
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Oct 21, 2009
  • Posts: 2330

  Posted: Jul 22, 2007 - 07:30 AM

  czardogs

  I've built and sold so many PN sites I can't even remember how many, but sadly most of them have been converted to another CMS after the buyer has complained they cannot work with PN. And that goes to what nestormateo says about usability.

  
  
  While PN certainly does have some usability issues, this doesn't fall under usability. It is the responsibility of the paid developer to use sound judgment in the solutions that are provided to clients, after all.
  
  If the developer provides a solution that is technically too advanced for the client, the developer has already failed in the primary task of choosing a proper solution. If a client cannot successfully manage the end-product at the outset, training must be provided or the job cannot be called complete...at least not to a professional level. Again, developer failure.
  
  Essentially, when a developer has established a continuing pattern of dissatisfied clients, this indicates other issues at the forefront. Typically, poor implementation and/or insufficient client training will be found at the root of the problem. And other times, the developer sold the client a 'steamship' when only a 'motorboat' was needed, simply because the developer was more versed in steamships, so to speak. In any case, a developer should make every attempt to avoid making the same mistake(s), client after client.
  
  This is all just general observation that can apply to any business, and not just the business of installing/developing PostNuke sites. Nonetheless, these things should be carefully examined by any developer who is noticing a pattern of their clients being dissatisfied with the end product as it can unfairly undermine the credibility of PostNuke as a whole.
  
  ...and besides, happy clients are repeat clients!!
  
  In the spirit of full disclosure, I make this constructive criticism based as much on experience as observation. ;)

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• czardogs
  
  

  • Rank: Softmore
  • Registered: May 01, 2003
  • Last visit: Apr 09, 2010
  • Posts: 470

  Posted: Jul 22, 2007 - 08:20 PM

  Alar the ones I sell are not commissioned projects - they are usually cold calls because of the premium domain they are on, the profit they are making, or me selling them to gain a profit.
  
  I do commissioned projects built on PN - I maintain the website under contract so there is no worry as to them having problems. I should have been more clear.
  
  Ones I have sold outright - they usually don't last on PN. That has noting to do with me, my way of conducting business or anything else other than the buyer not liking or being able to work with PN.
  
  
  
  edited by: czardogs, Jul 23, 2007 - 12:24 AM
  
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• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Senior
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Oct 21, 2009
  • Posts: 2330

  Posted: Jul 23, 2007 - 02:30 AM

  I do not mean to question your business procedures, I'm making an observation that, in spite of the reasoning, holds true. What I do mean to make clear is that client migration and the inability of clients to work with the implemented solution has nothing to do with usability issues; it's only 'at home' that this issue can be resolved because it stems from there. To put it into perspective: if you give someone a jumbo jet, there's no reasonable expectation of their success in flying it when they only have experience with paper airplanes. Would this fall under usability? Obviously not. Nor is usability the issue at the root of anyone's client migrations and client unhappiness.
  
  I would suggest that, rather than defending a process that has historically led you to client dissatisfaction (regardless of fault), this situation should be used as a learning experience. What system do these people migrate to? How can you use this information to your advantage in creating happy clients in the future? How can implementing incorrect or overkill solutions be avoided?
  
  In my PostNuke Professional opinion, the client's success with the product should not hinge solely on whether or not they keep the developer on board. That might well be characterized as unfair to the client and unprofessional of the developer. Again, this would point to the developer not offering proper training, which is essentially setting the client up for failure.
  
  In any case, the PN name takes it on the chin when a developer produces an unhappy client, regardless of the reasoning behind the situation.
  
  Again, I do not mean any ill intent in these observations. What I'm saying is not unfounded, and could quite easily fit under common sense, but I've tried to word it as delicately as possible for the sake of constructivity. I hope that it is viewed this way.

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