Zikula Community

• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Registered User
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Feb 09, 2004
  • Posts: 2

  Posted: Feb 08, 2004 - 01:41 PM

  When I say I am a Nuke outsider, I mean that I am not "tied" to it. I am a consultant who primarily deals with LAN/WAN design and troubleshooting, but I get an occasional request for a "site" tossed my way. I got enough requests that I decided it was worth the effort to see what was out there in the way of a quick solution; Something that my customers could maintain on their own after I set it up.
  
  I got my introduction to Nuke (PHPNuke) shortly afterwards, and thought it was a great concept. Give a non-coding client an open source, out of the box (so to speak) website solution that requires no expertise to maintain and then kick back. All the customer would need to do at that point is sit in a room with the other nine hundred ninety-nine monkeys at their typewriters and re-invent Shakespeare. Afterwards, posting Hamlet on the web should be a snap.
  
  I just got done doing a site for a client in PHPNuke, and after having installed PostNuke on a scratch server just today, I wish I had used it instead. I find PostNuke to be a much more mature project in terms of direction and control. There is more attention to the presentation of content, security (a must), and the evolution of the software. The installation was incredibly simple, operation is for the most part fairly intuitive, and the layout is much more flexible and clean looking.
  
  With PHPNuke, it seems that the website is built around the message board more than the message board stems from the site as with PostNuke. If all I wanted was a board, I know how to handle that. I would slap up an IkonBoard (my first love) or IPB. Most of the people developing for PHPNuke seem to be in love with the idea of doing something just to do it. This is a good thing, of course, in the abstract. But it wasn't making my job any easier. What I needed was something my customers could use and that looked professional - I wasn't looking for proof-of-concept demonstrations. It was a tough slog to put together a compelling product for them.
  
  It looks to me at first blush like the PostNuke dev team is more concentrated on delivering true site management than a collection of gadgets and gizmos. This is a blessing because my clients aren't PC Gamers, code hackers, or teens wanting 'blogs. They are interested in mature business solutions that can be implemented quickly with minimal costs associated. They want to pass information on to clients and employees in order to get business done. They expect functionality to go hand-in-hand with a certain amount of panache regarding looks.
  
  The forums are used to discuss lessons learned and to ask questions, not to be the core of the site. Security is a primary concern to them. They are in the business of business, and don't want to become full time coders and web specialists. They expect (and rightly so) a product that let's them carry out their business as easily as possible.
  
  PostNuke seems to be exactly what my customers are looking for.
  
  I think the main part of my feedback (this isn't criticism) would be themes. Please bear with me, because I know I am being totally unreasonable. :D
  
  With the installation and operation of PostNuke being so simple, most sites could be up and running nearly instantaneously. But let's face it, end users could care less about how many thousands of man hours went into the code. They expect that stuff to work, just like they expect their engine to turn over when they twist the key in the ignition. Most consumers buy the car for the body style and paint job, not the engine.
  
  "Wow, that sucker looks COOL!"
  
  "I" understand the attention to detail that has gone into the coding, the security, and the functionality. I like the flexibility. I would feel completely comfortable recommending PostNuke to a client because it would meet their business needs. They would still want it to look cool, though. And they would want that part of things to work as easily as everything else.
  
  If you guys and gals could build some easy customization options into the "look and feel" portion of the software, you'd have it all licked. Add in a custom Theme Builder module, whatever, and you would have to match head spins with Linda Blair to look back far enough to see the competition.
  
  I ain't the Siskel & Ebert of the PHP set, but I can say, as a professional in the IT field, that I am exceptionally impressed with your product!
  
  See ya'll later, gotta go stuff this soap box back in the closet...

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• HalbrookTech
  
  

  • Rank: Developer
  • Registered: Dec 31, 1969
  • Last visit: Jun 01, 2010
  • Posts: 6859

  Posted: Feb 08, 2004 - 03:24 PM

  Quote

  If you guys and gals could build some easy customization options into the "look and feel" portion of the software, you'd have it all licked. Add in a custom Theme Builder module, whatever, and you would have to match head spins with Linda Blair to look back far enough to see the competition.

  
  
  Download and install the XTERC2 package along with the theme packs from the downloads area and see how much it may take care of that. XTE is the theme system for .8. I think it does a good deal of what you're talking about, and seems to go further in the next version of PostNuke from my basic glances.
  
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• AbraCadaver
  
  

  • Rank: Expert
  • Registered: Aug 20, 2002
  • Last visit: Jan 12, 2010
  • Posts: 1219

  Posted: Feb 08, 2004 - 06:10 PM

  So, PN doesn't yet have a "custom Theme Builder module" built-in, but you can try out the new Xanthia module that will be included and is avaialble now.
  
  Or, check out AutoTheme. Hundreds of themes are already available for it if you want to download and go or buy and go -- or easily create your own.
  
  -Shawn
  
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• nate_02631
  
  

  • Rank: Senior
  • Registered: Sep 22, 2003
  • Last visit: Oct 21, 2009
  • Posts: 2774

  Posted: Feb 09, 2004 - 03:09 AM

  On the flip side of the coin, it could be somewhat dangerous giving a PN admin access to *everything*, such as being able to customize the themes via the admin.
  
  The look & presentation of your site is very important for many reasons, including navigability, coherence, first impressions, etc... It is not something, I feel, that you should be able to update on a whim through the admin - or worse yet have someone who doesn't understand the concepts of good design be updating.
  
  I think there's no getting around the fact you have to get your hands dirty a bit to get the desired layout for your site. It's not something you'll be doing every week, and as AbraCadaver pointed out, there are plenty of ready-made themes available.
  
  Even if you did put some kind of item to edit templates online (which both AT and Xanthia feature), you'll still have issues to deal with like creating images (navigational, logos) for the theme and custom logic for theme presentation. It's just not something you'd be able to cover in an online module to a complete degree, and again, not something the average joe should really have easy access to.
  
  AutoTheme and Xanthia make theme design for anyone who can use a WYSIWYG editor and I've even taken some time to "demistify" theme creation here. My only gripe with PN has been the difficulty of customizing module output, but it seems that will be addressed with pnRender (but again, not for the faint of heart!)
  
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• **unknown user**
  
  

  • Rank: Registered User
  • Registered: Mar 16, 2002
  • Last visit: Feb 09, 2004
  • Posts: 2

  Posted: Feb 09, 2004 - 02:04 PM

  I will give Xanthia a try, and will definitely check out nate's "demystification" doc's!
  
  As I said, I am exceptionally impressed with PN. I just think the addition of some way for a relatively competent end user to set up some basic window dressing would be good. And I agree whole-heartedly that there will ALWAYS be a dirtying of hands in terms of digging, tweaking, and occasionally breaking (and fixing, of course) :D
  
  That is totally unavoidable, but that is also what we are paid for...
  
  Thanks for your suggestions!

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